Figure 1  Palo Duro Canyon, Texas.   Palo Duro Canyon is one place where Young Earth Creationists (YEC) have claimed that the unconformities recognized by geologists cannot really represent long periods of time. (Thomas 2019; Clarey 2018) 

PDF file available here

Are there “incontrovertible” reasons to affirm a young Earth? What does it mean to be incontrovertible?  Some YEC seem to believe that this means that it is claimed by any YEC author that they appreciate.  It is easy to list claims that might sound impressive.  What happens if we dig into those claims?  Can they stand up to analysis?

Geologists interpret the tremendous amount of sedimentary rocks on the Earth to have been deposited over billions of years.  That is a big disconnect with YEC claims that the Earth is 6,000 years old.   When we look at canyon cuts around the world, we often see many layers of almost horizontal strata.  Many times, geologists claim that a lot of time is represented by some of the boundaries between layers of rock.  Is that reasonable? This is another look at one the “incontrovertible” evidences from Paul Humber’s “Reasons to Affirm a Young Earth”.  (Humber 2013)

 

The reason given in this case is:  

17. Smoothness between Layers

This reason from Humber’s booklet actually involves two different issues, so I will use two separate discussions to cover them.  This is Part 1.  First, we can look at the observation from nature and then the assertions that Humber makes regarding them.

Observation 1:  Layers of sediment often don’t show much erosion between them.

 

Assertions:

1. “Lack of erosion or slight erosion between defined layers is consistent with demonstratable rapid deposition of the oncoming layers.”

 2. “Ubiquitous evidence of erosion along the entire surface must exist if the layers were deposited with millions of years between layers. (A single unconformity with no erosion undermines uniformitarian geology.)”

The observation is true in the sense that in many areas, layers can be parallel to subparallel and there are apparently long periods of time between them in some cases.  YEC have written about this observation many times.  One example is from Ariel Roth in 2009 is “ Flat gaps” in sedimentary rock layers challenge long geologic ages. (Roth 2009)

Unconformities with parallel layers that locally do not show obvious erosion do not surprise most geologists. Erosion along unconformities is not expected to be dramatic everywhere along it.  In fact, dramatic unconformities where the dip of the beds above and below them are markedly different, known as angular unconformities, are typically local features enhanced by faulting or the folding that took place. Away from this enhancement, the same surface may not show obvious signs of erosion. Sometimes it is a matter of the scale that we are looking at. I have traced unconformities on seismic lines for hundreds of miles, usually apparently conformable, but in local areas, often at the ancient shelf edge, we will find demonstratable erosion at the seismic scale.

Perhaps one characteristic that surprises YEC and other non-geologists is that parallel beds can be millions of years different in age. The unconformity surface can be compared to a Bible.  The time between when the Old Testaments was written and New Testament times was about 400 years.  In some Bibles, there is a section of extra pages, while in others, virtually nothing separates them.  The missing time interval from the Bible is just missing.  We have to use data from other sources to learn what happened.  With geologic outcrops, what we can prove at a particular site is what happened when the beds below were formed and what happened afterward. If the processes right above the unconformity were erosional, we may get a clear erosional surface.  It may be relatively depositional.  It also may include a lot of time of just non-deposition.  At one particular site, we can’t prove how much material has been eroded, if any.

Related insights:

Llano Estacado in New Mexico and Texas Vs. YEC and Flood Geology

Roth, 2009 believed that he could use an average rate of erosion to determine how much material should have been removed.  This would be like trying to calculate the rate of calendar time represented in the Bible by counting the pages. Average rates of deposition and erosion similarly are often meaningless and can be misleading. The point is that much could have happened between the layers and we simply have nothing to tell us locally what that was. We can’t calculate how much should have been eroded any more than we can somehow calculate that there were 400 years between the Old and New Testaments by counting the pages between them in our Bible.

What appears in an outcrop to be parallel and without erosion may not be the case at all.  Often, we need to look at data over a bigger region and even use visualization tools to make the subtle features more recognizable. The observation that in some locations the beds are parallel (or roughly so) is not surprising because these occur in settings that were stable in terms of tectonic activity. Erosional surfaces in tectonically stable areas can be carried over large distances without showing recognizable erosion at a seismic scale.  If we are able to follow them far enough, there will always be evidence of erosional truncation.  When examining seismic to identify unconformities and important surfaces, we always look at it vertically exaggerated.  Beds which look parallel and without incision often show a change in dip and erosion when the seismic is stretched vertically. 

Can Paleosols develop during a Flood??

Roth, 2009 believed that he could use an average rate of erosion to determine how much material should have been removed.  This would be like trying to calculate the rate of calendar time represented in the Bible by counting the pages. Average rates of deposition and erosion similarly are often meaningless and can be misleading. The point is that much could have happened between the layers and we simply have nothing to tell us locally what that was. We can’t calculate how much should have been eroded any more than we can somehow calculate that there were 400 years between the Old and New Testaments by counting the pages between them in our Bible.

What appears in an outcrop to be parallel and without erosion may not be the case at all.  Often, we need to look at data over a bigger region and even use visualization tools to make the subtle features more recognizable. The observation that in some locations the beds are parallel (or roughly so) is not surprising because these occur in settings that were stable in terms of tectonic activity. Erosional surfaces in tectonically stable areas can be carried over large distances without showing recognizable erosion at a seismic scale.  If we are able to follow them far enough, there will always be evidence of erosional truncation.  When examining seismic to identify unconformities and important surfaces, we always look at it vertically exaggerated.  Beds which look parallel and without incision often show a change in dip and erosion when the seismic is stretched vertically. 

It might surprise people to realize that major changes in erosion and deposition are often not obvious to the eye.  Dr. Jim Coleman, a famous geologist from LSU taught a seminar for Mobil Oil on the Mississippi Delta that I attended.  He loved to give the example that if the water were missing, you could walk down from the Mississippi River delta in New Orleans across the continental shelf, down the slope, across the Mississippi fan to the abyssal floor without the eye ever perceiving a bit of relief.  Important stratigraphic changes are often subtle when viewed without vertical exaggeration. It is not as though beds deposited millions of years apart are actually totally parallel, but the eye simply does not pick up on the subtle differences. Large scale erosion when beds are almost parallel is often virtually unrecognizable until the tool of squeezing the seismic or the photograph is used.

In looking at the Palo Duro Canyon, I used the unconformity between the Triassic and Miocene sediments as a case in point. (Mitchell 2021) (Figure 2) Dr. Timothy Clarey of ICR reported “The lack of any visible erosion is strong evidence that there were not millions of years between the deposition of the Triassic beds and the overlying Ogallala.” (Clarey 2018)  It is true that in many areas, the Triassic and Miocene aged sediments are almost parallel.  When the setting is a broad relatively stable continental basin, we should expect that there will be a lot of parallel sediments. The fact is that when this unconformity surface is  carried towards the Gulf of Mexico, a thickness of over 7 miles of rock is present there that is younger than the Triassic and older than the Ogallala (Mitchell 2018; 2021). Some material has been eroded away in the Palo Duro Canyon area, but very little deposition probably ever took place in the Llano Estacado area over most of the early Cenozoic era. We do find outcrops with thin late Mesozoic, i.e. Cretaceous marine sediments, but even these sediments are thin. The major deposition took place in the Gulf of Mexico basin during the period that is missing in Palo Duro Canyon. 

Figure 2  Palo Duro Canyon, Texas.  Significant time is missing along unconformities at the  Quartermaster Formation / Dockum Group boundary and at the Dockum Group / Ogallala Formation boundary.

Erosional surfaces in tectonically stable areas can often be carried over large distances without showing erosion.  Maybe a good example to look at is the Quaternary record in the Gulf of Mexico.  I don’t think any YEC interprets these to have been deposited during Noah’s flood.  We have a record of high-resolution sea-level falls, each of which has an unconformity at its base.  We then have a record of sea level rises with thin limestone or limy beds laid down.  These are continuous over broad areas.  Harry Roberts and Jim Coleman wrote about this after detailed studies in the Quaternary section of the Louisiana distal shelf and slope. (Roberts and Coleman 1988) Along the stable shelf one would be hard pressed to demonstrate erosion along the unconformities.  They had very high-resolution seismic, but until you get to the depositional slope, no erosion is demonstrated.  Then they found clear evidence of erosion. My point is that we can, in such cases, demonstrate that unconformities can be identified and carried for long distances without any noticeable erosion.  Such distances are greater than even for those seen in outcrops, even in the Grand Canyon.  Many of the sections exposed in the Colorado Plateau such as those at the Grand Canyon were laid down in tectonically stable conditions just as were those in the Gulf of Mexico.

 

Looking at the two assertions that Humber made:

  1. Certainly rapid deposition could cover an erosional unconformity but the deposition could as easily have been slow. Extremely rapid processes tend to have an erosional base, though there are exceptions.  Whatever cut the erosional surface is gone.  Whatever covers it came later and is not necessarily related to the cutting event.

 

  1. I would agree that a significant unconformity should have erosion but it does not follow that there will be “ubiquitous evidence of erosion along the entire surface”. It certainly would not need to be simple to recognize.

A related problem for flood geology is the fact that there is evidence of extensive physical and chemical weathering below some unconformities.  Obviously, this is not at all points along such surfaces, but it is observed and it is well documented.  See Pevehouse, et al.,2020, “Paleotopography Controls Weathering of Cambrian-Age Profiles beneath the Great Unconformity, St. Francois Mountains, SE Missouri, USA.” Or Fei, et al., 2023, “Paleo-weathering of different basement rocks along a first-order nonconformity – case study at the post-Variscan nonconformity (Germany)” (Pevehouse et al. 2020; Fei, Hinderer, and Hornung 2023) (Figure 3) The chemical weathering of igneous and metamorphic rocks did not take place over weeks or months but thousands and perhaps hundreds of thousands of years or more.

Figure 3.  Stratigraphic column from Pevehouse, et al., 2020 showing the Great Unconformity as it is expressed in southeast Missouri.

I have shown that we should not be surprised to have unconformities with little evidence of erosion. While some unconformities locally have dramatic changes in the angles of the bedding, many do not.  In many cases, the missing time probably does not represent much rock that has been eroded away, but included long periods of basically non-deposition. We have seen that there can be evidence of the passage of long periods of time by the presence by chemical weathering zones.  Part 1 of this reason to believe in a young Earth just isn’t supported.

References Cited

Clarey, Dr Timothy. 2018. “Palo Duro Canyon Rocks Showcase Genesis Flood.” Institute for Creation Research. June 29, 2018. https://www.icr.org/article/palo-duro-rocks-showcase-flood.

Fei, Liang, Matthias Hinderer, and Jens Hornung. 2023. “Paleo-Weathering of Different Basement Rocks along a First-Order Nonconformity – Case Study at the Post-Variscan Nonconformity (Germany).” CATENA 227 (June):107070. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.catena.2023.107070.

Humber, Paul G. 2013. Reasons to Affirm a Young Earth. Vol. e-book revision. https://static1.squarespace.com/static/54235fb7e4b0dab08d8d81dd/t/57d6e6b3d482e999611d7888/1473701556828/ReasonsAffirmYE+CRS+e-book.pdf?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR0J_JCi_6zH1KuNlHYrgIJjTAhCgOm4zwio8ks44k5CGnJIAiETnqThXLI_aem_BA94GfB1gm5q86tQj_pW2w.

Mitchell, Stephen. 2018. A Texas- Sized Challenge to Young Earth Creation and Flood Geology: A Christian Geologist Looks for Answers. Christian Faith Publishing, Inc.

———. 2021. “Llano Estacado in New Mexico and Texas Vs. YEC and Flood Geology – Jesusinhistoryandscience.” Jesus in History and Science (blog). January 5, 2021. https://jesusinhistoryandscience.com/?p=2163.

Pevehouse, Katie J., Dustin E. Sweet, Branimir Šegvić, Charles C. Monson, Giovanni Zanoni, Stephen Marshak, and Melanie A. Barnes. 2020. “Paleotopography Controls Weathering of Cambrian-Age Profiles beneath the Great Unconformity, St. Francois Mountains, SE Missouri, USA.” Journal of Sedimentary Research 90 (6): 629–50.

Roberts, Harry H., and James M. Coleman. 1988. “Lithofacies Characteristics of Shallow Expanded and Condensed Sections of the Louisiana Distal Shelf and Upper Slope.” Gulf Coast Association of Geological Societies Transactions 38:291–301.

Roth, Ariel A. 2009. “‘Flat Gaps’ in Sedimentary Rock Layers  Challenge Long Geologic Ages.” Journal of Creation, August. https://creation.com/flat-gaps.

Thomas, Brian. 2019. “Does Palo Duro Canyon Show Deep Time?” Institute for Creation Research. 30 2019. https://www.icr.org/article/does-palo-duro-canyon-show-deep-time/.